Stop Supporting Rapists*

So I was meaning to put a post up yesterday about an interesting issue I found in a recent paper, but yesterday's "breaking news" about Donald Trump has put me in a foul mood. I don't want to fill the post with rhetoric and opinionated commentary, so I thought I'd hold off for a bit.

Rather than just stay quiet for a week or so, I thought I'd copy a comment I just wrote showing my state of mind. If you support Donald Trump, I suggest you don't read it. Then again, if you support Donald Trump, I suggest you just leave. My site, the internet, the planet. whichever you prefer.

By the way, that last comment might have gone a bit more off-topic than it should have, but this whole Trump-sexism thing has put me in a foul mood. Donald Trump has constantly said sexist and bigoted things while posturing about how he can do whatever he wants. Most famously, he said he could shoot a person in full public view and not lose any voters. In what world could it possibly be surprising he has sexually assaulted women?

And yes, I said Trump "sexually assaulted" women. Trump's remarks people have been discussing recently aren't just vulgar. They're admissions Trump has committed crimes and sexually harassed women. And that isn't surprising at all. It's perfectly in line with everything we've seen from him thus far, yet people are acting like this is shocking news they never could have anticipated.

Uh... no. This is exactly what I expected of Trump. Trump has spent his entire campaign basically going around saying, "I'm a vulgar, disgusting man with no morals who can get away with anything." And people supported him for it. What's changed? Oh, now we have recordings of this vile, disgusting man talking about how vile and disgusting he is? How is that any different than the hundreds of other things he's said in speeches broadcast on national television?

This is like how people praise and support stereotypical frat boys who sexually harass women for years without making any effort to hide it then act shocked when, "Oh my god, they raped somebody? How could we ever have anticipated that?" And just like with stereotypical frat boys, many of the same people will keep supporting Trump.

[*]Because hey, he just sexually harassed and assaulted women. It's not like he actually raped them. We've got to give him credit for that...?

25 comments

  1. Is there a documented and proofed evidence that The Donald "raped" a woman? I mean there is plenty of evidence against a succesful other president Bill Clinton, even in th oval room itself, but Trump? Please send us a link to these cases of The Donald.

    I remember a movie with Micheal Douglas in which he was raped by his female boss. I dont believe this made any impact on the world except on some peoples fantasies...

  2. PS The face of Bill Clinton was priceless when he heard the charges in the debate he attended. Like made out of stone inclusing the ash color.

  3. Hoi Polloi, given this post explicitly states Donald Trump did not rape anyone, I find peculiar you write:

    Is there a documented and proofed evidence that The Donald "raped" a woman?

    I would think asking a person for evidence something happened when they explicitly state it didn't happen would strike anyone as bizarre. Maybe not. Maybe some people think it's reasonable. That, or perhaps some people just can't be bothered to read the posts they respond to. I'm betting on the latter.

    By the way, in the future you might want to refrain from saying things like:

    I mean there is plenty of evidence against a succesful other president Bill Clinton, even in th oval room itself, but Trump?

    As the natural reading of your comment is there is "plenty of evidence" Bill Clinton raped someone in the Oval Office, a ludicrous claim nobody in their right mind should believe.

  4. Trump's remarks people have been discussing recently aren't just vulgar. They're admissions Trump has committed crimes and sexually harassed women.

    Are they actual admissions or just macho bragging and posturing? Trump is not known for his veracity, but he has been known to brag.

  5. Canman, I guess one could argue the admissions are false, and thus aren't really "admissions," but that seems like a stretch. It also seems to make Trump worse. A person who thinks sexually harassing people is okay enough to brag about having done it is bad enough, but to then lie on top of that? What kind of presidential candidate would brag about committing crimes he didn't commit? I mean, yeah, it'd be good that he didn't sexually harass people, but it'd make him look even more pathetic.

    I don't think these admissions are false though. At least one person had accused Trump of doing this before the tape of him admitting to it was released. When someone accusers a person of a crime and then a recording is found with the person boasting about having committed the crime, it seems probable he did in fact commit that crime.

  6. Hoi Polloi, consider the context of what Brandon is writing. It is clear he is referring to the defense of Trump as not raping like Bill Clinton.

  7. If Trump is considered as someone who lies and exaggerates to build up his image, why shouldn't we think he is doing the same here?

  8. Hoi Polloi, there is evidence that Trump has committed rape. One of his ex-wives claimed it, and someone else has a lawsuit against him alleging that as well. Also, there is Trump's friendship with the billionaire of Pedophile Island, who Trump declared liked women 'on the younger side'. It has not come up as an issue because the British press has revealed that Bill Clinton flew on the guys plane to the island several times. Has not been directly named by the woman who has implicated some of the princes.

  9. Thing is, he hasn't claimed to sexually assault women. He is joking that he can get away with whatever he wants if he's a big star. He doesn't mean get away with it legally as in the murder on 5th avenue, but that the women will let you do it.
    Presumably this would also qualify as sexual assault under the all-encompassing law, but it is not in my view.

    I realize Trump likely has done these things, with primary evidence being that Anderson Cooper kept asking him to deny it.
    Team Clinton definitely put him up to that.

  10. In my opinion the only way to stop supporting rapists is to vote for Trump.

    Donald Trump is declared to have called Alicia Machado Miss Piggy, and the media put her on nonstop to detail her tale of woe.

    Juanita Broaddrick declares that Bill Clinton raped her, and the media collectively airs one interview, asks Bill Clinton one question where his response is ""Well, my counsel has made a statement about the ... issue, and I have nothing to add to it.", and that's it.
    Kathleen Willey declares that she was sexually assaulted by Bill Clinton, and feminist leaders declared it was OK because he only did it the one time.

    It is clear that the media will hold Trump to account while rape and other crimes is excused with the Clintons. Not just excused, but ignored.

  11. As an administrative thing, can we please try not to have quintuple posts? There may be times where the amount of information justifies it, particularly if there is time taken between comments, but it should usually be possible to compress things into a smaller number of comments.

  12. Trump's comments were completely unsurprising.

    That he thought it was a good thing to make them to Billy Bush, while his mic was on, was a little surprising - he really is that stupid?

    Also, notice in the clip how he doesn't know how to open the bus door. A guy who doesn't know how to open a door, who thinks it's a good idea to get all jock-bro with Billy Bush, who forgets about his mic, seriously contending for the presidency ...

  13. Szilard, Trump sized up his opponents and decided he could seriously contend. I guess that he figured there was a decent chance Hillary would collapse before the election. Indeed, she has been unable to climb steps and open doors herself, and also had trouble with a subway card...
    No jock-bro for her, just chatting up down and dirty with Lena Dunham.
    At least Trump didn't have Billy speaking at the convention.

  14. Your statement that he is admitting to "sexual assault" is incorrect, because he is bragging that they were fine with it. If they were fine with it, it cannot be sexual assault.

    You can say, "well, he's wrong, they weren't fine with it", but you'd have to at least have one of them come forward. If you grab the privates out of the blue of anybody anywhere and they don't mind (and don't complain), you haven't committed sexual assault.

  15. Rob, he didn't say anything about anyone being okay with it. He said they'd let you do it. That's not the same thing. That somebody might let you assault them and not protest does not indicate they are okay with it. Please don't conflate a failure to complain with consent.

  16. MikeN, a problem with that interpretation (in addition to there not being anything to base it on) is people who believe it would almost certainly be wrong in practical cases. Trump might believe people wouldn't complain about that sort of behavior from him because they wouldn't mind it, but the reality is many wouldn't complain but would mind very much. He wouldn't be able to know the difference.

    I'm not going to guess just what Trump does and does not believe. I suspect it changes on a regular basis. What I will say is if he thinks what you think, that's disturbing. That sort of thought could lead a person to sexually abusing others while believing what he did was right because "they wanted it."

  17. (in addition to there not being anything to base it on)
    Of course there is something to base it on- the meaning of what he said. It's like saying there is no evidence Trump has groped anyone, when you have him on video talking about it.
    You are right about the 'false positives', but saying it is disturbing, you first have to recognize that what he is saying is true for a substantial number of women. With Bill Clinton only a handful came forward. Perhaps there were many more who didn't like it but didn't wish to speak out. There were also many who were quite willing. The Tom Brady tape I linked is an example, what you find disturbing, SNL just laughs off.

    I don't think it is certain that Trump has engaged in this behavior. He is an exaggerator and liar, so he may have done so on the video as well. The behavior of his kids just doesn't match the persona Trump shows. You would expect at least one jerk in the group.

  18. MikeN:

    (in addition to there not being anything to base it on)
    Of course there is something to base it on- the meaning of what he said. It's like

    You shouldn't use a word when defining it. In the same way, you shouldn't say the basis for your interpretation of what was said is "the meaning of what he said." It's a tautology.

    You are right about the 'false positives', but saying it is disturbing, you first have to recognize that what he is saying is true for a substantial number of women. With Bill Clinton only a handful came forward. Perhaps there were many more who didn't like it but didn't wish to speak out. There were also many who were quite willing. The Tom Brady tape I linked is an example, what you find disturbing, SNL just laughs off.

    Had Trump pointed this out (perhaps as a lamentable situation), nobody would have complained. That's not what he did though. He boasted about it. There's a big difference.

    I don't think it is certain that Trump has engaged in this behavior. He is an exaggerator and liar, so he may have done so on the video as well. The behavior of his kids just doesn't match the persona Trump shows. You would expect at least one jerk in the group.

    Whether or not he groped women without their consent, he certainly forced women to let him see them naked. That's sexual harassment. If people want to parse whether Trump has sexually assaulted or only sexually harassed women, they can. I don't know what difference it would make to anything though. I doubt the difference would affect anyone's view of him.

  19. Again, I think the source of that is also just Trump, bragging on Howard Stern. One of the beauty pageant winners said she never saw anything like that, but who knows.

  20. MikeN:

    Again, I think the source of that is also just Trump, bragging on Howard Stern. One of the beauty pageant winners said she never saw anything like that, but who knows.

    You can think that all you want, but thinking don't make it so. Trump was accused of having done this prior to going on the radio and boasting about having done it. That is, a woman accused Trump of sexual harassment, then he went on the radio and bragged about how he engages in that exact form of sexual harassment.

    Interestingly, the same is true of the sexual assault story. Trump had been accused of sexual assault (and attempted rape) at least as far back as 1997. I know you like to portray all this as just a guy bragging about things he wouldn't actually do with there being no evidence to support accusations, but when a person is accused of a crime then publicly boasts about committing that crmie or being able to commit that crime, I think there's a bit more than just empty boasting involved.

    Yes it's a tautology. That's why I don't think you should say there is nothing to base it on.

    I feel like you may not know what a tautology is. It basically takes the form of, "A is true because A is true." Claiming it is wrong for me to say it there is no basis is like saying, "But there is a basis, A is true!"

  21. Of course there is evidence Trump has done these things. I said that above. It is possible he is guilty of everything. It just seems like he is not completely filling the character being painted, and I think he might just be all about building his brand and lying to promote that. No kids being jerks, and Trump's abstinence of smoking, drinking, and drugs(as far as we know), makes me think it's possible.

    As for tautology, if someone says, "There is no basis for claiming that Chicken Little meant 'The sky is falling down.'" I think it is fair to argue "Chicken Little said 'The sky is falling down.'", even if the other person thinks it is properly interpreted as 'This guy is falling down.'

  22. MikeN:

    Of course there is evidence Trump has done these things. I said that above. It is possible he is guilty of everything. It just seems like he is not completely filling the character being painted...

    I don't know what "character" you think is being painted, but as far as delusional, misogynistic, racist sexual offender, he seems to have filled it eprfectly. Are you referring to some other character?

    As for tautology, if someone says, "There is no basis for claiming that Chicken Little meant 'The sky is falling down.'" I think it is fair to argue "Chicken Little said 'The sky is falling down.'", even if the other person thinks it is properly interpreted as 'This guy is falling down.'

    You may think this "fair" all you want (even though the analogy is obviously not a fair depiction of our situation), but it won't have any effect on whether or not that other person's interpretation is correct. Interpretations are about meanings, not simply repeating what words were said.

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