2011-07-06 04:16:17Climate Chaos: Christian Parenti’s New Book Exposes How Global Warming Could Lead to Global Warfare
John Hartz
John Hartz
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Climate Chaos: Christian Parenti’s New Book Exposes How Global Warming Could Lead to Global Warfare

This is a radio interview between Amy Goodwin and Chrisitan Parenti posted on DemocracyNow.

Take a couple of minutes to read the transcript and/or listen to the interview.  

How do we get Amy Goodwin to interview John Cook?

2011-07-06 06:07:17
Paul D

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This is off topic for SkS.

It's the politics of environmentalism.

If I want to read about this, then I can go to Greenpeace or other organisations.

2011-07-06 06:18:53
nealjking

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I agree with Paul. We are interested in consequences of GW/CC, but I think we can draw a line after the direct consequences:

- land use or availability/unavailability

- impact on agriculture

 

How humans are going to respond to that is important, but I think there are other groups and sites that can discuss that. It's going to be difficult to analyze such situations without a strong political framework in which to understand it; but any such framework we adopt will alienate some people.

I think we have enough on our plate to convince people about the scieince and the physical implications; if we get inito the political framework, we will lose focus AND audience.

2011-07-06 06:51:21
perseus

owlsmoor@googlemail...
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Off topic for general chat?

Have you ever read Climate Wars: The Fight for Survival as the World Overheats? 

One scenario it considers is a drought in Southern Asia.  Pakistani rivers rise in India but they can be diverted in case of drought. This gives rise to a limited nuclear war between these countries. 

Another scenario is a badly affected nation using stratospheric sulfur injection unilaterally

2011-07-06 07:05:12
nealjking

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I think even general chat should not be such as to drag the attention off into another dimension.

I don't want to use SkS as my sole channel of communication to the world. I don't want to be bombarded from all directions by it. Let's keep a sense of focus.

2011-07-06 07:13:48
Paul D

chillcast@googlemail...
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I didn't say it was off topic for general chat.
But that isn't what Badger was implying.

2011-07-06 08:13:09
Riccardo

riccardoreitano@tiscali...
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The original "mission statement" for this forum says "This is just for kicking back and relaxing, when you need to take a break from saving the planet :-)". Let people post what they wish.

2011-07-06 08:23:52Wait a darn minute!
John Hartz
John Hartz
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I posted this because I thought some of you might be interested in knowing about Christian Parenti's book and reading the interview. Nothing more, nothing less.

 

2011-07-06 08:39:02Amy Goodman interviews Jeff Masters
John Hartz
John Hartz
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News at 11: How Climate Change Affects You

2011-07-06 08:47:37
Daniel Bailey
Daniel Bailey
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I agree with Badger and Riccardo.  I don't read everything in the Chat section or even the Blog posts section of the Forum (not enough time).  And its not like we're carrying on this discussion in a blog post thread (or even advocating that we do so).

That being said, it takes little imagination to see that climate change/reduced water supplies could be used as a pretext for a theatre-level nuclear exchange between Pakistan and India, with India taking it on the chin (Pakistan is somewhat more likely to initiate a "first-strike" than is India).

2011-07-06 11:34:58
nealjking

nealjking@gmail...
84.151.50.14

Well, I normally check in several times a day, so if all sorts of stuff gets tossed on, I'll have to limit myself.

I guess my concern would then be if anything "actionable" gets dumped into the General Chat, I'll miss it.

If you guys want to bring in stuff for amusement, then maybe we can agree that NOTHING urgent or requiring broad review should be placed here.

2011-07-06 13:19:05nealjking
John Hartz
John Hartz
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I find nothing amusing about wars being fought over scarce resources caused by climate change.

PS -- I sure the heck wish you had told me before now that SkS was a CIA operation.

2011-07-06 19:07:17
nealjking

nealjking@gmail...
84.151.48.6

?

2011-07-06 21:51:51nealjking
John Hartz
John Hartz
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"Actionable."

2011-07-06 21:55:56
nealjking

nealjking@gmail...
84.151.48.6

the word means different things to different people.

My interpretation: Anything that someone is expected or hoped to take any action about.

2011-07-06 23:20:55nealjking
John Hartz
John Hartz
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There are three pieces of "actionable intelligence" (CIA term) in my initital post.

1. The reader chooses to click on the article link, or not. 

2. The reader chooses to respond to my question, or not.

3. The reader chooses to criticize me for posting the article, or not.

2011-07-08 03:00:17Along the same lines as the original story...
John Hartz
John Hartz
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"Over the next few decades, tens of millions of people will be driven from their homes. Braving violence and poverty, they’ll roam desperately across continents and borders in search of work and shelter. Unlike other refugees, though, their plight won’t be blamed simply on the familiar horrors of war or persecution; they’ll blame the weather.

"If you haven’t heard about the rising tide of environmental migrants, that’s because throngs of displaced black and brown people don’t evoke the same public sympathy as photos of polar bear cubs. The governments of rich industrialized nations will scramble to shut the gates on the desperate hordes with the same self-serving efficiency with which they’ve long ignored the social, ecological and economic consequences of their prosperity. But both efforts at blissful ignorance will fail, because climate change is forcing society to confront the mounting natural and man-made disasters on the horizon.

The above are the lead p"aragraphs of "The Globe’s Not Only Getting Hotter. It’s More Unjust and Unstable, Too" by Michelle Chen, posted on ColorLines.com.

To access the entire article, click here.