2011-08-28 08:06:31Michaels Mischief #2: Opposing Climate Solutions
dana1981
Dana Nuccitelli
dana1981@yahoo...
69.230.106.125

Michaels' latest blog post is an attack on renewable energy and electric cars/plug-in hybrids, which he admits he doesn't like because the government supports them.  So I connected it to Spencer's comment about his job being to minimize the role of government, then pointed out the many errors in Michaels' arguments.

Michaels Mischief #2: Anti-Government Bias

Michaels Mischief #2: Opposing Climate Solutions

2011-08-28 15:39:39
Tom Curtis

t.r.curtis@gmail...
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It is probably convenient to tie Michael's errors discussed in the post under the rubric "Anti-Government Bias".  Never-the-less, claiming that somebody has an anti-government bias, and that that is a mistake, however well justified, is still a political judgement.  In keeping with the SkS ambition to stick with the science, I would recommend a new title and introduction.

 

 

 

2011-08-28 16:23:36
dana1981
Dana Nuccitelli
dana1981@yahoo...
69.230.106.125
I agree on the title - I was kind of hesitant about that. I think the intro and text are okay though. I'm just pointing out what Spencer and Michaels have admitted about their own biases.
2011-08-28 17:23:10
Tom Curtis

t.r.curtis@gmail...
112.213.174.72

I understand what you are saying, but "bias" is one of those dicey words.  Sort of "I'm perceptive", "You are focussed", "They are biased".  And while it is certainly capable of a non-offensive meaning, it will not be taken that way.  Particularly when coupled with "ideological".

2011-08-28 19:39:58
perseus

owlsmoor@googlemail...
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I would stongly disagree that Electric cars have as much as 5 times the well-to-wheel energy efficiency of vehicles using internal combustion engines. The inefficiencies mount up for both these drivetrains once all the components are multiplied together.  Here are a few liberal estimates for the electric:

Efficiency of battery discharging 0.9
Efficiency of battery charging 0.9
Efficiency of battery charger 0.9
Combined efficiency inverter+motor 0.8
Efficiency grid transmission 0.91

Efficiency of power station =                          0.4

This amounts to only about 20%, without allowing for the power station fuel. Admittedly the IC engine can be far worse, but it is not as bas as 4% except arount the town perhaps, whilst on the highway Diesels can reach 40-50% efficiency with only minor reductions for refining and transmission.

 

2011-08-29 01:26:35
dana1981
Dana Nuccitelli
dana1981@yahoo...
69.230.106.125
Well, it depends on the type of power station used. I'll change it to "several times". And Tom, I'll get rid of the word "bias".
2011-08-29 04:02:14Articles re the Chevy Volt
John Hartz
John Hartz
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98.122.98.161

Dana,

Here are some articles re the Chevy Volt that I had flagged for the Sierra Club's Transportation Chairs ListServ.

Could the Chevy Volt Really Help Reduce Global Warming?

Chevrolet Volt's official MPG: 60 mpg (sort of)

Motor Trend slams Limbaugh for attacking the Chevy Volt: “Driving and Oxycontin don’t mix” - Car reviewers rave about GM's PHEV while Rush fumes.

Sorting Myth From Fact as Volt Makes Its Debut

 

2011-08-29 06:21:10
perseus

owlsmoor@googlemail...
188.220.205.42

Dana

If you require a reference these may be useful

"EV batteries. When the entire energy chain is considered, studies generally conclude that battery-electric cars are roughly 10% - 30% more energy efficient than conventional gasoline cars, depending on the particular assumptions of vehicle energy use and energy chain efficiency."

http://www.rqriley.com/ev-tech.htm

THE CLEANEST CARS: WELL-TO-WHEELS EMISSIONS COMPARISONS

See Table 2: Well-to-Wheels Energy and Emission Changes for Fuel/Vehicle



2011-08-29 06:40:59
dana1981
Dana Nuccitelli
dana1981@yahoo...
69.230.106.125
Thanks badger and perseus.